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11:01:18 I made it.
11:01:22 Hi, rob.
11:01:30 And we'll be.
11:01:30 Hi, rob.
11:01:31 Good! Hey? Doug.
11:01:33 Okay. Lobosh, welcome.
11:01:35 Good morning!
11:01:36 Good morning!
11:01:37 It's interesting to have someone say, Good morning.
11:01:43 For me, too.
11:01:44 You're in Victor.
11:01:44 We are all in different places.
11:01:47 Yeah, yeah, exactly.
11:01:52 And different seasons. What.
11:01:55 That's true. It's cold here.
11:01:57 It's it's hot. It's warm here, so.
11:02:03 I'll see if I can share.
11:02:27 The snow on Mount Wellington this morning.
11:02:30 Let me say.
11:03:00 Hmm.
11:03:03 Interesting.
11:03:15 Penny! Here.
11:03:26 I thought I'd be able to show you.
11:03:31 What's happened. We've got some snow on Mount Wellington, anyhow. That's the short version of it.
11:03:36 Quite a bit.
11:03:40 Goody, Dave! Welcome.
11:03:41 And we go to Woodpecker here.
11:03:47 We we know about package. They they take calls in trace, don't they?
11:03:52 To build, nest.
11:03:54 Anyhow. So what's going on.
11:03:57 Well, the woodpeckers, woodpecker, pack apecap, poka.
11:04:02 Well, the woodpecker is happening on the divers.
11:04:04 Now appear.
11:04:06 What is going on.
11:04:07 That we could speak about that would be useful.
11:04:11 For your colleagues.
11:04:33 That the 3rd day.
11:04:35 That I 1st met Milton Ericsson. It was about a Wednesday, I think.
11:04:40 I arrived to his house.
11:04:43 And there was no one else there.
11:04:46 I went into his waiting room, and Betty.
11:04:49 Pushed Ericsson into his.
11:04:51 Uh.
11:04:52 Office in his wheelchair.
11:04:54 And he looked at me.
11:04:57 Didn't say anything.
11:05:00 And I looked at him.
11:05:02 And I didn't say anything.
11:05:05 I felt so tangled. I travelled halfway around the world to sit at the feet of this master.
11:05:13 And he wasn't going to help you to start a conversation.
11:05:17 So he just looked around.
11:05:20 And the the more the silence continued.
11:05:24 The more.
11:05:27 Restricted in.
11:05:28 Paralysed. I felt.
11:05:31 And.
11:05:32 I didn't say anything, and he didn't say anything.
11:05:35 And after about 10 or 15 min.
11:05:37 He picked up the phone.
11:05:40 And he said to Betty, Take me into the house.
11:05:42 And dismiss me for the day.
11:05:44 So.
11:05:46 If I didn't have anything to initiate.
11:05:49 Don't worry about it. Don't even think about it.
11:05:52 So the next morning on the Thursday.
11:05:55 I had some questions.
11:05:58 I wasn't going to waste another day.
11:06:00 Now. I don't know why that that story came to my mind, but anyhow.
11:06:05 That that was just there. So I spoke it.
11:06:15 Maybe.
11:06:15 Look like Dave had something to say uh, but I'm not sure.
11:06:19 Ah! Date.
11:06:21 Yo.
11:06:23 Did you have something to say?
11:06:28 Um.
11:06:30 But.
11:06:32 One of the things that um.
11:06:35 I guess is uh we're in me at the moment is uh. I've had a number of clients.
11:06:40 Who fall asleep.
11:06:43 Um.
11:06:45 And sometimes it's obvious people are asleep. Sometimes it's not obvious.
11:06:49 That they're asleep.
11:06:51 Um.
11:06:53 And I sort of struggle of uh.
11:06:57 Whether how important the focus is.
11:06:59 But you know client has to be focused.
11:07:02 Um.
11:07:03 And.
11:07:05 If they're falling asleep. Is that a major issue.
11:07:13 The Good question, Dive.
11:07:15 I had a friend years ago.
11:07:19 Every time he went to a dinner party he went to sleep.
11:07:24 But at the end of the dinner party he knew that everything that had gone on.
11:07:30 When he went to the to the movies.
11:07:33 Every time a movie came on a film came on. He went to sleep.
11:07:38 But at the end of the film he knew exactly what had happened.
11:07:42 So some people look like they're asleep.
11:07:46 But they're just.
11:07:49 Um attentive, with their eyes closed.
11:07:53 So one of the one of the.
11:07:58 Sometimes people look like they're asleep, and they.
11:08:02 And.
11:08:04 One of the ways of of.
11:08:06 Clarifying this.
11:08:08 I found.
11:08:09 Is.
11:08:11 To reach over and lift their arm.
11:08:13 If I reach over and live there, say their right arm.
11:08:18 And if they go oh, watch that.
11:08:22 Then they were asleep.
11:08:23 But if I lift their right arm and stays there.
11:08:30 Then I think it's ratification of the fact.
11:08:35 That they're in trans.
11:08:36 And they got their eyes closed.
11:08:39 But if you lift their arm and they go, oh, watch that.
11:08:42 We, we can also, we can always.
11:08:48 Handle that by saying.
11:08:50 Now, as you notice your right hand.
11:08:52 That can be interesting for you to.
11:08:54 Lay your eyes to close and go into trance again.
11:08:58 So, sometimes.
11:08:59 It can be helpful.
11:09:02 To.
11:09:04 I'm not sure whether it's helpful for us or for the client, but in any case.
11:09:07 If it's an issue.
11:09:09 I think.
11:09:12 Lifting someone's arm to produce some catalepsy.
11:09:15 Or asking them to move their finger.
11:09:18 If they're still listening.
11:09:22 If they can hear what we're saying.
11:09:23 Maybe their index finger can lift.
11:09:26 And that can.
11:09:26 Can give us an idiomota.
11:09:29 Signal up there!
11:09:31 They're in.
11:09:32 In contact.
11:09:35 The the other general.
11:09:38 Um comment that we can make is that.
11:09:41 If someone looks like they're asleep.
11:09:43 We can.
11:09:46 Offered the idea.
11:09:48 That the deeper.
11:09:50 You go to sleep.
11:09:52 The more benefit that you'll have from this.
11:09:54 Experience.
11:09:57 I remember reading about an American.
11:10:00 A family therapist. I can't remember his name now, but.
11:10:03 If he was having trouble with a family.
11:10:06 He would go to sleep.
11:10:09 And then.
11:10:11 Couple of things.
11:10:12 One of several things could happen.
11:10:15 One thing that he noticed is that if he went to sleep.
11:10:19 The family would say, What's going on here.
11:10:23 Who it looks like he's gone to sleep. So why are we here over.
11:10:25 And they would have a conversation amongst themselves and resolve their problem.
11:10:32 Other times this guy would would.
11:10:34 Go to sleep.
11:10:36 And then he would come out of his sleep. He'd wake up and say.
11:10:40 Oh!
11:10:41 Who is a snipe, and while I had a snipe I had a dream about a family not unlike you. Also.
11:10:45 Blah blah blah blah.
11:10:47 So that he was able.
11:10:49 Use.
11:10:51 Sleep.
11:10:53 And and and suppose dream.
11:10:57 As a metaphor.
11:10:58 For the family to learn from.
11:11:01 So I'm making a bit of noise here, Dave.
11:11:04 And I've got no idea.
11:11:06 About.
11:11:08 Whether anything that I'm saying is going to be helpful to you.
11:11:12 Whether it's.
11:11:14 Something that's here that I'm.
11:11:16 That that you, already aware of.
11:11:19 Whether there's something new for you or for anyone else.
11:11:23 But I am curious to.
11:11:25 To hear from you.
11:11:27 About what's different now that I've made all that.
11:11:30 What do you reckon about that.
11:11:41 The um.
11:11:43 I do keep forgetting about idiomatic responses.
11:11:48 Uh-huh.
11:11:50 I.
11:11:52 Probably because of it, in a sense, get on a role.
11:11:56 This is what I'm doing. This is.
11:11:57 Mm-hmm.
11:11:57 Um.
11:12:00 It's a bit like when when you perhaps start and you're using a script or something.
11:12:05 It's got to start middle and end.
11:12:08 And sometimes, when I'm working with a client, is much the same.
11:12:13 Um I've got in my head.
11:12:16 Where I'm going with this.
11:12:17 What I'm doing with it.
11:12:19 A way, in a sense where it will end.
11:12:24 And perhaps I get bound up in that.
11:12:28 Without thinking.
11:12:30 I should check.
11:12:32 Are they? Are they asleep?
11:12:33 The.
11:12:34 Can I get them to lift their finger or.
11:12:38 Take a deep breath or something like that, so that.
11:12:43 I'm getting feedback.
11:12:44 Okay.
11:12:48 Um. Yeah.
11:12:49 So I think there's there's no clear demarcation, or remember.
11:12:54 One of the times I was with Milton. I think it must have been the 1st time in the 1st 2 weeks that I was there.
11:13:01 I was in surprise. He was talking, and I started to go into trance, and he said.
11:13:05 Went up.
11:13:11 So that was not an indirect suggestion. It was not.
11:13:15 A subtle.
11:13:17 Idiomota.
11:13:18 Invitation.
11:13:20 Wake up!
11:13:22 He just he just gave me a very.
11:13:25 Strong.
11:13:27 The.
11:13:28 Invitation.
11:13:30 To not go into French.
11:13:33 So.
11:13:35 I think anyone who's got a specific answer.
11:13:38 It's not worth listening to. But I like what you're saying about.
11:13:42 Getting getting some idiomotor.
11:13:44 Getting some response from the person.
11:13:47 To let them know.
11:13:49 If the.
11:13:52 If there is a connection.
11:13:55 Between us and the client.
11:13:57 If there is.
11:13:59 Let's go.
11:13:59 If there's not any indication, then we can always offer the possibility that.
11:14:05 Even though you're not listening to me, you're in your own experience, and you can make use of this.
11:14:09 So we can benefit that.
11:14:12 But.
11:14:13 There's. There's, I think, your idea of getting the the.
11:14:18 Connection is is a useful.
11:14:24 A useful importance.
11:14:27 Um.
11:14:29 Michael. Yep, co, and you know here's a funny fellow.
11:14:33 He. He said that that as a criticism of the Erikssonian approach of telling stories.
11:14:38 He said too often.
11:14:43 Stories are left.
11:14:46 Like unwanted babies.
11:14:48 On the doorstep of the unconscious.
11:14:51 Hoping to be taken in.
11:14:55 So I think that that if we say.
11:14:58 You might be asleep, but you can blah blah blah.
11:15:01 That's an unwanted baby.
11:15:04 Now.
11:15:05 If that door step with the unwanted baby.
11:15:10 Is a doorstep into a house that people wanting a baby.
11:15:14 I'll take it in.
11:15:16 So there's a possibility of it being useful.
11:15:20 There's no guarantee.
11:15:23 So.
11:15:25 They they appreciate your question.
11:15:28 And and and the.
11:15:33 Dive.
11:15:34 I appreciate your question, and my invitation is.
11:15:38 To have the question and to play with it.
11:15:41 See what you can find out.
11:15:47 Thank you. Thanks for the question.
11:15:49 Anyone else got any comments about that, or questions about that, or something different.
11:15:56 Nina.
11:15:58 Uh, I I also.
11:15:59 Can you hear me, Rob?
11:16:03 Okay. Okay. Thanks.
11:16:05 So i i i also appreciate that question from Dave, because.
11:16:09 Yesterday I drove.
11:16:11 I had this question.
11:16:13 That I did not get to ask.
11:16:16 And ah, and.
11:16:17 And it's related, it's totally related. Because, if you remember.
11:16:23 What happened was that Ruben was presenting.
11:16:26 Ah! Something.
11:16:27 A hypnotic session.
11:16:29 Ah! As a pre-surgery.
11:16:32 Ah! Preparation!
11:16:33 And in that.
11:16:34 Um.
11:16:36 He did prepare the client.
11:16:39 For the surgery in the sense that he did use the words, that there will be some messages.
11:16:45 That either the doctor or the nurse, whoever took charge of taking those index cards.
11:16:51 Mm.
11:16:51 With the messages for her. Him.
11:16:53 For whoever that was under surgery.
11:16:55 Him.
11:16:55 So he he said, you will be hearing messages, so that to me was really good.
11:17:02 As a pre-hypnetic like.
11:17:05 Uh suggest a suggestion and something to play with.
11:17:09 Before the person.
11:17:11 Uh is invited into hip. Notice, hypnosis, or an experience of absor.
11:17:18 Focused absorption, letting them know that.
11:17:21 Ah!
11:17:22 It is possible for some people may may actually fall asleep.
11:17:26 During this process, or maybe Cody for whatnot.
11:17:30 And.
11:17:31 And.
11:17:32 The part of you that will be the. There will be a part of you listening.
11:17:36 To what's important.
11:17:39 What is important or whatever the wording uh needs to be, for that person.
11:17:44 Because.
11:17:45 Ah! Up!
11:17:47 Victor made a comment. And Hector is a doctor right.
11:17:51 And he said.
11:17:53 After any, when when someone is is under anesthesia, hearing.
11:17:58 Is the first.st Ah!
11:18:00 1st to go.
11:18:01 And the last to come back. The sense of here so.
11:18:05 But that made that was my question. Is that.
11:18:10 Is there.
11:18:12 A part of us.
11:18:13 Still listening, if not with this.
11:18:15 If not with this.
11:18:18 A part of us.
11:18:19 Is listening, even if we're even when we're under anesthesia.
11:18:25 So.
11:18:27 Especially if somebody is queued or prepared.
11:18:31 For it to come as a pre hypnotic uh, you know. Suggestion.
11:18:35 So I didn't get to ask it yesterday, and I thought it was, you know, related uh.
11:18:42 It's something I've been thinking about.
11:18:45 Isn't that fascinating.
11:18:46 You know.
11:18:46 Barry.
11:18:47 Dive dive is thinking about when someone's asleep.
11:18:51 But Ruben was introducing the possibility of being able to be in communication with someone who's being anaesthetized.
11:18:58 Right.
11:18:59 You know Ernest Hilgard, all of those decades ago.
11:19:04 Talk in. In his understanding of hypnosis he talked about the hidden observer.
11:19:11 That, no matter what's going on, there is a part of us.
11:19:15 That that Ernest Hill Guard talked about.
11:19:18 Cool with the the.
11:19:20 He didn't observe it.
11:19:21 Who is observing.
11:19:25 Now, for example.
11:19:27 When I'm asleep at not.
11:19:30 Our dog sleeps on our bed.
11:19:32 And if she wants to go outside.
11:19:35 To do away.
11:19:38 She!
11:19:40 Now I'm asleep.
11:19:42 And when she barks I hear the bark.
11:19:45 Now does the back wake me up.
11:19:49 So that I take her outside.
11:19:51 Or.
11:19:53 Do? I.
11:19:54 Am I asleep?
11:19:55 And the.
11:19:58 I noticed the bar.
11:20:00 And know that it that I have to take her outside.
11:20:04 And that wakes me up.
11:20:05 Mhm.
11:20:06 Is it the fact that wakes me up.
11:20:08 Or do I just wake up and then notice the back.
11:20:11 Yeah.
11:20:12 Mm-hmm.
11:20:12 Now nobody can. Nobody can give you a definite answer to this, but I think.
11:20:18 The, the, the.
11:20:20 Usefulness of Dave's question.
11:20:23 And the usefulness of of what you are adding to it.
11:20:28 From Ruben's notion of.
11:20:30 People having the possibility of responding or listening while they're anesthetized.
11:20:36 Opens the possibility.
11:20:37 Right.
11:20:38 Who anyone who says.
11:20:40 This is the case, or this is not the case.
11:20:45 Don't bother listening.
11:20:46 Okay.
11:20:47 Yeah.
11:20:48 So.
11:20:50 When when Ruben was talking yesterday about going to a safe place.
11:20:57 I stopped listening to him.
11:20:59 Mm-hmm.
11:21:00 And I went to a particular place in in the country. Victoria.
11:21:04 Mm-hmm.
11:21:06 Her Lobos may know about it.
11:21:09 Between Gippsland. It's a link.
11:21:11 Called Polycom.
11:21:14 And I went to telecom in in.
11:21:18 Listening to what Ruba was talking, and I stopped listening to him.
11:21:21 And I went to telecom.
11:21:25 No, I haven't been there for.
11:21:27 60 years.
11:21:29 Mhm.
11:21:29 I was there.
11:21:31 Mhm.
11:21:32 We'll had a very, very.
11:21:36 Intense experience, of remembering.
11:21:38 Tally Khan.
11:21:39 Hmm.
11:21:40 Mhm.
11:21:41 It is at the base of amount.
11:21:44 Wellington, would you believe? And I'm living in Hobart.
11:21:47 There's another man, Wellington, just close by.
11:21:51 But like telecom.
11:21:54 Is a very interesting life.
11:21:58 The. There is no obvious.
11:22:02 Inflow.
11:22:03 And no obvious outflow.
11:22:06 If you walk around to the head of the leg.
11:22:09 You can see a waterfall.
11:22:12 Which is a waterfall of the Niger Thorac Creek.
11:22:16 And there's a little trickled of water.
11:22:19 It, then dries up.
11:22:22 Mm.
11:22:22 And because and the the ground is completely dry.
11:22:27 So there's no.
11:22:29 Obvious connection.
11:22:31 Between the Nigorac Creek and Lake Talleyan.
11:22:35 If you go to the outflow.
11:22:40 The outflow happens.
11:22:42 At the bottom of what a rocky outcrop called the sentinel.
11:22:48 And the way the way they like.
11:22:51 And drains.
11:22:52 Is through what's called the.
11:22:55 Failing of destruction.
11:22:57 Mm.
11:22:58 And the story is that that a rock.
11:23:00 Paul.
11:23:01 From the sentinels.
11:23:03 Mm.
11:23:04 Fill.
11:23:06 Maybe hundreds, thousands of years ago.
11:23:09 And fell unblocked.
11:23:11 The outflow.
11:23:13 With rocks.
11:23:15 But it's still.
11:23:16 Goes, yeah.
11:23:17 And the interesting thing to me in in my ceiling, with that.
11:23:24 Ruben doesn't know about like telecom.
11:23:27 He doesn't need to know.
11:23:30 And I made an.
11:23:31 A connection there of.
11:23:33 Thing there, and seeing how.
11:23:35 Beautifully.
11:23:36 Peaceful it was.
11:23:38 Mm.
11:23:39 And also to connect with the fact that there was no sense of.
11:23:44 Where it came from.
11:23:46 Where it was going from.
11:23:48 Mm.
11:23:48 Something, about.
11:23:50 The.
11:23:52 Title of the.
11:23:53 Valley of Destruction.
11:23:56 There was something about that.
11:23:58 That stayed with me.
11:24:02 Now all of that happened within May. It had nothing to do with Ruben.
11:24:05 It was just in inviting us to.
11:24:08 Be in the place.
11:24:12 The funny thing was.
11:24:15 Then I had a.
11:24:17 A message from my oldest son, Andrew.
11:24:19 Here's today.
11:24:21 And there was a photograph of him next to a sign saying, Mcneely Park.
11:24:27 Mhm.
11:24:29 And I said, Where is this?
11:24:32 And he said, Oh, it's in.
11:24:36 It, it.
11:24:37 Town.
11:24:38 On the way.
11:24:40 To Gippsland.
11:24:42 Oh, wow!
11:24:43 See on the way to Ty.
11:24:45 Paul.
11:24:47 There's yeah. Well.
11:24:50 Park.
11:24:50 Mcneely.
11:24:52 Wow!
11:24:53 Mm-hmm.
11:24:54 So. Not that that means anything, but it's just.
11:24:59 Just an experience that I had.
11:25:01 That touch me.
11:25:03 You're right.
11:25:04 That is going to stay with me for some time, I imagine.
11:25:09 Thank you.
11:25:12 Lib. Do you know, Gippsland, have you been to Gippsland.
11:25:17 Yeah, I do. I do know, Gibson, I didn't go to that particular lake. But yeah, I did a bit of walking and bush walking around Gibson.
11:25:26 But mostly in.
11:25:29 In the central Gippsland. This is, I think, this is in the East.
11:25:33 Yeah. She kept saying, Yes.
11:25:35 So if you, if you come from where you live.
11:25:39 And you'll come down through the north.
11:25:41 West.
11:25:44 Through bulla and buffalo.
11:25:46 Yeah, you can go over the hills.
11:25:49 Quotas.
11:25:49 Mary and Jane, and and and so on.
11:25:52 But if you go to a script you go to.
11:25:55 Down from the south of Victoria.
11:25:56 And then.
11:25:58 Going going east and then going north, up through.
11:26:03 Now a Terlan.
11:26:04 Oh, yeah. Yep.
11:26:06 High failed. Laca.
11:26:09 Willing to the Mcallister River.
11:26:11 Wellington River, and so on.
11:26:14 Yeah, you know it. Well, I drove through that couple of times. Not that many.
11:26:21 It's um, you know. It's a long way.
11:26:24 It's a long way.
11:26:25 There's a beautiful walk where you can go from Gippsland.
11:26:29 From the call up.
11:26:30 Through Mount Wellington, the snow airplane.
11:26:32 And you can come down to Mansfield.
11:26:35 Ah!
11:26:35 Go from the stop.
11:26:37 Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
11:26:38 Come to the.
11:26:39 To, the.
11:26:40 So.
11:26:43 Anyhow, that's that's just blah blah blah.
11:26:45 For you, and I.
11:26:47 That's geography.
11:26:51 Mm.
11:26:54 Beautiful place, beautiful.
11:26:57 Mm.
11:26:58 Hey, Robert, I can make a comment about um, Dives.
11:27:01 Observations.
11:27:03 Please.
11:27:03 My observations have been when people are.
11:27:07 Power in coma.
11:27:08 Um. I believe I still.
11:27:11 Receive communications and react to them.
11:27:14 And my observation when people are needed.
11:27:18 When they go into that unconscious date they are.
11:27:21 Able to.
11:27:23 Prices, messages. And yeah.
11:27:25 I don't know about Anthusia. What do you think there is? But.
11:27:30 Just think um.
11:27:32 And I've I've been told by medical people.
11:27:34 Hearing is one of the last.
11:27:38 Tens of goes when you're you're passing.
11:27:40 Mm-hmm.
11:27:42 And I think I think that's I've seen that. Yeah.
11:27:45 That as well, yeah.
11:27:48 One.
11:27:49 Just I I just keep trying. I mean.
11:27:52 No matter if they're in time or in consciousness.
11:27:55 You keep talking. You just don't know fully.
11:27:58 The possibilities.
11:28:00 Yeah.
11:28:01 While connecting.
11:28:03 I want to emphasize what you're saying. There, Doug, about you don't know.
11:28:09 You know.
11:28:08 But we can keep trying. There is the possibility of being able to influence someone.
11:28:14 There's the possibility.
11:28:16 And we can play with that. We can take advantage of that possibility.
11:28:20 Hmm.
11:28:21 It doesn't mean that we can definitely.
11:28:25 Communicate with someone.
11:28:27 If someone is dying, and we say, Oh, don't die yet!
11:28:31 You know there's some other things that you should do first.st That's not a way of stopping them dying.
11:28:36 No.
11:28:37 Maybe.
11:28:40 Maybe if you say to someone who's very meticulous.
11:28:43 You can't die yet, because you haven't paid your last bill.
11:28:46 They might come back from death.
11:28:48 In order to pay the last gas bill.
11:28:51 Maybe.
11:28:53 But it's not ah, not ah, not hesit.
11:28:55 Not a recommendation. It's not a guarantee.
11:28:57 No.
11:28:59 It's. It's interesting. Doug.
11:29:00 And I think it's relevant to all of us.
11:29:04 That.
11:29:05 We say what we say.
11:29:09 And people hear what they hear.
11:29:12 Not necessarily as a function of what we say.
11:29:15 They hear what they hear.
11:29:17 And they have their response.
11:29:20 Within themselves.
11:29:21 To what they hear.
11:29:23 Yeah.
11:29:25 So that is when someone's in a coma, when someone's asleep, when someone's an.
11:29:32 Or when someone is just in conversation with us.
11:29:38 You know Dave was concerned about.
11:29:40 Someone pinging in, trans.
11:29:43 And um.
11:29:46 And being a slave.
11:29:49 But.
11:29:50 Goodness, saying.
11:29:52 Don't we? Haven't we all had the experience.
11:29:55 Of being in conversation with someone.
11:29:57 And we've gone somewhere.
11:29:59 Yeah.
11:30:00 We haven't gone to sleep. We know they're not being hypnotised. We're not being anaesthetised. We're not dying.
11:30:06 We just we don't hear it.
11:30:07 We're gone.
11:30:10 Everyday trains.
11:30:11 Yeah, like I went to. I went to Lake on. When when.
11:30:15 Yeah.
11:30:16 When Ruben was talking.
11:30:20 And not only that.
11:30:21 As Ruben was talking early on in the conversation about closed captions.
11:30:27 I forgot to record the session.
11:30:30 No.
11:30:31 I got so distracted with with that.
11:30:36 And.
11:30:38 Possibility of how to how to.
11:30:40 If closed, caption.
11:30:43 I forgot to press the record button.
11:30:44 No.
11:30:45 I mean, really, what a loony, what a.
11:30:49 There must have been anaesthetized, or dying, or.
11:30:53 Entranced was something.
11:30:55 But, like you say, common, everyday trans, we can do those things.
11:30:59 June.
11:31:00 And and they they happen.
11:31:05 In everyday life, and they can happen when in hypnosis.
11:31:09 That can happen with.
11:31:10 Ah!
11:31:12 Anesthesia.
11:31:14 That could happen with commas.
11:31:16 That can happen.
11:31:17 That can happen.
11:31:18 Room.
11:31:20 Thank you for that. Yeah.
11:31:22 Yeah. So I think that what you're saying there about.
11:31:26 About commerce, and what.
11:31:29 Main is reminding us about.
11:31:31 I'm Ruben's.
11:31:32 Notion of.
11:31:34 Anesthesia.
11:31:35 And and Dives a question about.
11:31:40 Uh going to sleep.
11:31:42 It's just a reminder.
11:31:44 That.
11:31:46 We can't know what people are going.
11:31:49 You know.
11:31:49 Here when we make a noise when we talk.
11:31:55 In bums.
11:31:55 Think it was Hans Fanster who said that the meaning of any utterance.
11:32:02 Is in the listener.
11:32:04 Not the speaker.
11:32:05 Yeah.
11:32:06 And are not claiming that that is true. But what an interesting.
11:32:11 Perspective.
11:32:14 So someone misses us.
11:32:16 It doesn't mean that they need to get a hearing aid.
11:32:20 It means that we need to talk differently.
11:32:22 Yes.
11:32:23 Game.
11:32:25 And and following on from that, I'm seeing more.
11:32:29 Um.
11:32:31 Clients! Now, come in.
11:32:33 And you ask him what they want to join, what would be useful to them.
11:32:38 And some coming with prepared lists, sometimes.
11:32:41 I'm talking. Maybe you know.
11:32:43 It is.
11:32:44 You know, 12 pinks.
11:32:46 And um, I'd say half, or probably about 30% of my case load at the moment is like that.
11:32:53 That come in, and they got anxiety. They got depression. They got white wealth.
11:32:57 I manage my got smoking. They got drinking.
11:33:01 Mhm.
11:33:01 And I just.
11:33:02 Um.
11:33:04 Listen to them, listen to them, listen to them, and then ask them.
11:33:07 What do you want to do first? st
11:33:09 Yeah, exactly.
11:33:10 You know. Um. And then what do you want to do? Say? And and sometimes I'm fine, like one lady came in.
11:33:18 Um.
11:33:19 Saint, a.
11:33:21 Why is there?
11:33:22 Stop smoking. She stops smoking.
11:33:25 Um post session. Then she wanted to lose weight, so.
11:33:28 We did a bit of that. She came back to a second session.
11:33:31 Lose you might. And she said.
11:33:33 I don't think I need to see you anymore.
11:33:36 Okay.
11:33:37 That's a shame. I need your money, but otherwise.
11:33:41 But I found that interesting, you know, like, yeah, that respect.
11:33:46 That you? And yeah, X, and yeah, you give to the client and let them pick out.
11:33:52 If I need to come back.
11:33:53 Not the name.
11:33:55 They sometimes ask my opinion, I'll give it, but.
11:33:58 Leave it up a name.
11:33:59 Exactly.
11:34:00 And if if someone wants to stop smoking.
11:34:04 And they succeed.
11:34:06 Then nothing succeeds like success if they've already done that. So white is the next thing. What else you got.
11:34:13 Yeah.
11:34:15 Yeah, I find a common word is um.
11:34:18 Control.
11:34:19 Yeah. Uh-huh.
11:34:21 Yeah.
11:34:22 I've noticed that that serendipitously, that someone who said.
11:34:26 They wanted to stop smoking.
11:34:29 Told me, after they'd succeeded, that their golf improved.
11:34:31 Yeah.
11:34:33 What we didn't talk about.
11:34:40 What was that about.
11:34:42 Yeah.
11:34:43 Mhm.
11:34:43 There's something about when someone.
11:34:46 Succeeded, something.
11:34:47 Overcome, something, resolve, something.
11:34:50 That there's.
11:34:52 If I can speak metaphorically, there's more of them available.
11:34:57 Yeah.
11:34:58 For themselves.
11:34:59 Yeah, I.
11:35:01 My perspective on that is um.
11:35:04 Once I realize how to change their thoughts.
11:35:06 Mhm.
11:35:07 Being aware that thoughts, and how to change their thoughts on one particular thing.
11:35:11 There you go!
11:35:11 But yes, you know. Say, success goes on and on.
11:35:15 There you go. Yeah.
11:35:15 Dude.
11:35:19 Very nice.
11:35:20 Hmm.
11:35:24 Yeah, well.
11:35:26 Um. For some reason a lot of a lot more stress around the.
11:35:30 Community, in Australia.
11:35:32 Um cost of living. The weather.
11:35:36 Various things like that. Um.
11:35:40 It's not a lot of people.
11:35:46 View.
11:36:00 And you can look at the other people's stories. Ah, do you.
11:36:03 You don't.
11:36:04 Bad.
11:36:05 And we don't need to.
11:36:06 No.
11:36:07 They do?
11:36:09 They did.
11:36:10 They know.
11:36:11 Get you.
11:36:12 I think we need to have entity from.
11:36:14 People.
11:36:15 Open. We made and interact with.
11:36:19 No matter what the situation may be.
11:36:22 Yep.
11:36:24 Yeah.
11:36:30 That's the good news and the bad news. Don't the.
11:36:33 I had um.
11:36:34 A good friend years ago.
11:36:37 A psychologist, she said.
11:36:39 I wish I'd never met you.
11:36:43 She said, before I met you.
11:36:45 I used to have a full practice.
11:36:48 Now I've got all of these gaps.
11:36:52 All of these spaces.
11:36:54 The interesting thing is that she was married to that was she was married to Ivan.
11:37:00 And speak. I am.
11:37:02 A Buddhist.
11:37:04 And Ivan became a Buddhist.
11:37:06 What do you call it? Priest?
11:37:09 Gone!
11:37:10 And they started a Buddhist.
11:37:14 Retreat.
11:37:16 Process program.
11:37:18 And I suspect that that that happened because.
11:37:22 They had. They were both psychologists, and they both had some space.
11:37:26 Decided to do something.
11:37:30 Yeah.
11:37:29 So that was the good news. Bad news there.
11:37:32 Yeah.
11:37:33 Yeah.
11:37:34 Um.
11:37:37 What depends on how you.
11:37:39 If this 50 for bad news and good news um.
11:37:42 I've been in business most of my life, you know.
11:37:46 Been a big camera.
11:37:47 And um sort of retired very early, had a monthly, and then.
11:37:52 Come back into.
11:37:53 Hoping, that is, in prisons, with addictions and mental illness, and.
11:37:58 It.
11:37:59 I do what I do now. Um.
11:38:01 Meet people like yourself and Ruben and other people.
11:38:04 Mm-hmm.
11:38:04 Um. I get approached.
11:38:07 Still, you know, to get back into business and.
11:38:10 I declined to do so. Um!
11:38:14 In this, and what I do, I don't make much money at all, but.
11:38:17 The satisfaction, the.
11:38:19 Yeah.
11:38:20 Um.
11:38:22 The cell.
11:38:24 Were the the real work is there rather than the.
11:38:26 Yep.
11:38:26 Yeah.
11:38:28 Having, you know, millions of dollars in the bank account.
11:38:32 Exactly.
11:38:33 You know.
11:38:34 We when I 1st started my hypnosis practice.
11:38:38 Doug.
11:38:39 I had about 2 weeks work ahead of me.
11:38:41 Rome.
11:38:42 After a couple of years I had more and more gaps when I was thinking.
11:38:46 What am I going to do with this this time?
11:38:49 Got to do something with it.
11:38:50 So admit. Milton Eriksen and I got very interested in his approach.
11:38:55 Mm-hmm.
11:38:55 I started to.
11:38:56 Run.
11:38:57 Training programs about what I'd learned from him.
11:39:01 So I ran a three-day workshop about an introduction to Eric Sony, an approach or something like that.
11:39:08 I did that a couple of times, and people said, Oh, we'll want more.
11:39:12 So we did an intermediate, and then.
11:39:16 And so on, and it went from there. So.
11:39:18 When I got more and more.
11:39:20 Um.
11:39:22 Spices in my clinical work.
11:39:24 Yeah.
11:39:24 I was able to teach more.
11:39:26 No.
11:39:27 And then, when when the teaching became.
11:39:31 A little bit.
11:39:36 There was a possibility of doing some online work.
11:39:39 Like this.
11:39:40 And we. We've got someone here.
11:39:44 You know um Dave is in.
11:39:47 In, in, between, in, in Hobart.
11:39:50 And you were in Sydney, I think.
11:39:52 You counsel? Yeah.
11:39:53 Newcastle.
11:39:54 You.
11:39:55 And and.
11:39:57 Millioners in Canada.
11:39:58 Mm-hmm.
11:39:59 And Lo Bosch, originally from Denmark, and is now in.
11:40:03 In in Victoria, rural Victoria.
11:40:06 I'm in Melbourne now.
11:40:08 Oh, you're in Melbourne! Oh, that! Of course you are in Portland.
11:40:10 I used to be in Wodonga.
11:40:12 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Melvin, okay, so here are people.
11:40:16 That that are in different parts of the world.
11:40:21 And that would would not have happened if I had been.
11:40:24 Busy enough to.
11:40:26 To just do some online teaching with some some face-to-face teaching.
11:40:29 You.
11:40:31 So you never know.
11:40:33 You never know in your name.
11:40:33 And Ericsson said, you never know what's going to.
11:40:36 What's gonna happen.
11:40:38 He he said.
11:40:39 You never know what's around the corner.
11:40:42 No.
11:40:42 So you take whatever life hands out to you, and you make the most of most of it.
11:40:49 Agreement. Yes.
11:40:50 You know, he said, that that um.
11:40:54 When when he was growing up on the farm.
11:40:57 He wanted to be a farmer.
11:41:00 But he got told here.
11:41:02 So.
11:41:04 Cripple is no, no use on a farm.
11:41:05 So we had to do something else.
11:41:09 That a family friend said, well, there's always work for doctors.
11:41:13 So he did a medical degree.
11:41:15 And he was a lecturer.
11:41:17 Psychiatrist.
11:41:21 Who, said Eric, and I don't know where you got your limp from.
11:41:24 But if you ever wanted to become a psychiatrist, that would be useful for you.
11:41:28 Course you won't be a threat to to man.
11:41:30 Because you're a cripple.
11:41:32 And and women will want to mother you. So it's going to add to you. Add to your rapport.
11:41:39 So he went into psychiatric practice.
11:41:43 Um.
11:41:44 And he had a.
11:41:47 He was riding his bicycle and had a fall.
11:41:50 And and badly grazed his.
11:41:53 Himself.
11:41:54 In an area with a lot of.
11:41:56 Host.
11:41:57 Manure.
11:41:58 And there was ah! There was a concern about tetanus.
11:42:03 So he was allergic to horse serum.
11:42:08 And there was no Ted talk then. Then it was just anti.
11:42:12 Handy tetanus.
11:42:14 Talk, to.
11:42:16 And the the dilemma came.
11:42:18 To to giving the horse here, so he's going to be allergic to it, or do we let him dive.
11:42:24 He ran the risk and took the.
11:42:26 Took the serum.
11:42:28 He got a terrible allergic reaction.
11:42:31 And he was left with very severe.
11:42:36 Very severe allergies.
11:42:39 And the the doctor said.
11:42:41 Wisconsin is a very bad place for allergy. You better go to Phoenix, where.
11:42:46 It's a it's a dry desert place. You will have less trouble with you.
11:42:49 We can.
11:42:49 So he went to Phoenix.
11:42:53 And he got a job in the in the local hospital, and that didn't work. So he started to run.
11:43:00 Take a physical.
11:43:02 Psychiatric practice from his home.
11:43:06 And then, when it got more disabled, the polio caught up with him.
11:43:11 He he stopped seeing clients, and he started teaching.
11:43:14 Wrong.
11:43:16 So.
11:43:18 He said if he hadn't developed polio he would be.
11:43:21 Feeling it would have been a farmer.
11:43:23 Yeah.
11:43:25 If if he hadn't.
11:43:29 At that that accident.
11:43:31 He would still be in Wisconsin. He wouldn't have gone to Phoenix.
11:43:34 If he'd still. Then I kept his medical health.
11:43:39 Physical Health.
11:43:40 He wouldn't have been teaching.
11:43:44 Choke.
11:43:46 Like you should.
11:43:47 You never know what's around the corner.
11:43:50 You never know what life is going to dish up to you, which I think.
11:43:53 Yeah.
11:43:55 Yeah. And the good thing is, he never hold himself backy.
11:43:58 I think um one of the things I remember Michael saying.
11:44:02 I did a couple of master classes with him, and.
11:44:05 Is advising.
11:44:07 Big owner.
11:44:09 Is there any you get over yourself.
11:44:12 Yep.
11:44:12 Can we have get over yourself, you know.
11:44:14 Yes.
11:44:15 I think you got that.
11:44:18 Same sort of bum.
11:44:20 Putting yourself at risk.
11:44:24 Bad things.
11:44:23 Here, Michael, change, he, he used to say.
11:44:27 You are more than your past.
11:44:30 Okay.
11:44:30 And your future hasn't happened yet.
11:44:33 Okay, interesting, like that. Yeah.
11:44:35 Yeah.
11:44:36 The.
11:44:36 Interesting.
11:44:37 The acute cute perspective that fella.
11:44:40 Yeah.
11:44:42 And a lot of respect for them.
11:44:43 Yeah.
11:44:44 Disagree with so many things that he says, but.
11:44:46 I've got a huge amount of respect for him.
11:44:49 Dude.
11:44:50 Hmm.
11:44:51 You know down here much from you these days with Michael.
11:44:56 Um, he, he's teaching an online program. And he.
11:45:01 Contributes to.
11:45:03 And.
11:45:04 He's got a.
11:45:07 The evolution of psychotherapy.
11:45:09 He's got ah! An app that is.
11:45:12 That is, to design.
11:45:14 Okay.
11:45:14 He's good.
11:45:15 Yeah. I had a conversation with him. 10.
11:45:18 15 years ago.
11:45:19 About hypnosis online, he said. Oh.
11:45:22 Hypnosis. You couldn't teach hypnosis online.
11:45:24 I said, well, I don't know, Michael.
11:45:27 Good adventure.
11:45:30 Interesting.
11:45:32 Williams.
11:45:31 So he thought that it will, but now he's.
11:45:34 Is.
11:45:34 Doing it in spades.
11:45:36 You know.
11:45:37 He's a good man then, fellow.
11:45:39 Yeah.
11:45:43 There are a lot of good people around, you know. Billing is the same thing.
11:45:47 You know I've known Bill for.
11:45:49 40 years, boar.
11:45:51 And our our admiration and appreciation of that fellow.
11:45:58 But some of the things that he says are just playing wrong.
11:46:03 Yeah.
11:46:04 I can associate these. Um!
11:46:06 Songwriting.
11:46:08 Which recognizes, and all day and things like that. I can see that association there.
11:46:12 My goodness.
11:46:14 Yeah.
11:46:15 Can he, Hannah?
11:46:16 He ran a trauma center. One stage, didn't he? And.
11:46:20 He went in there.
11:46:21 We're busy.
11:46:22 Married to Pat.
11:46:24 Um. They lived in.
11:46:28 Where it is now.
11:46:30 But Pat's father was a minister, and.
11:46:34 I, I.
11:46:36 Agency that that he ran.
11:46:39 And Bill worked there with.
11:46:42 Marking.
11:46:43 Um choose. Choose good news that will.
11:46:46 Good news.
11:46:48 She had had.
11:46:51 The very quiet.
11:46:53 Uh perspective.
11:46:55 She!
11:46:56 Um a brochure that they use.
11:46:58 On! There!
11:47:00 In their agency.
11:47:02 And the the brochure was called warm.
11:47:05 WOM.
11:47:07 Mom.
11:47:09 And the brochure.
11:47:10 Warm, and you would but an old concept.
11:47:14 Warm, standard, for.
11:47:17 Stood.
11:47:18 Word of mouth.
11:47:20 Come on!
11:47:21 And in the brochure it said, If you like, what happened here, tell your friends.
11:47:26 Hmm.
11:47:27 I had. Ah had a brochure of that. I don't know where it's gone, but.
11:47:31 She!
11:47:31 No.
11:47:31 She was going to stick.
11:47:33 That I really liked it.
11:47:35 Yeah, yeah.
11:47:36 Don't!
11:47:38 You know, one of the things that built is.
11:47:41 That.
11:47:43 That that hypnosis is good for unconscious processes. No good wouldn't use hypnosis for something.
11:47:48 That someone does intentionally.
11:47:51 So when someone smokes a cigarette they intentionally put this there.
11:47:55 She wrote an email.
11:47:56 And they intentionally like it.
11:47:59 Lighted.
11:48:00 And they intentionally smoking.
11:48:01 So don't use hypnosis for smoking.
11:48:04 I mean, what what are you talking about, Bill?
11:48:08 I mean I could say this to his face. I'm not gossiping.
11:48:11 Behind his back, because.
11:48:13 I. I like him, and I respect him, but I do think he's just wrong about that.
11:48:18 I think that that.
11:48:20 I don't know. My experience is that.
11:48:23 And hypnosis can be so helpful for people.
11:48:26 They're wanting to do something.
11:48:28 Or stop doing something.
11:48:30 And they they know that they're doing it intentionally.
11:48:34 But they didn't know how to stop it.
11:48:37 So I think hypnosis can be hopefully.
11:48:41 Yeah. Well, when people come to me with smoking, drinking.
11:48:45 Um.
11:48:46 And substance, any, any addiction.
11:48:49 I always treat that as a.
11:48:53 That's a symptom of their problems, not the real problem.
11:48:56 Yeah, yeah.
11:48:57 I think we.
11:48:58 We come for the we emotionally, we.
11:49:01 We smoke, we drink, we take.
11:49:03 Medications.
11:49:05 To give us comfort in the way. I think.
11:49:08 Robbie said.
11:49:10 We try and say, we're going to stop this in our conscious mind, which is.
11:49:14 And critical mon of where you you know.
11:49:16 Fine.
11:49:17 It has no chance against the unconscious mind which is there.
11:49:22 To look after them. Protect us!
11:49:24 So, so, doug, sometimes.
11:49:27 The problem isn't the real problem.
11:49:29 No.
11:49:30 And sometimes the problem is the real problem.
11:49:35 Well, okay.
11:49:36 Because if someone has a strong emotion about their smoking their cigaret.
11:49:41 And they stopped smoking their cigarettes.
11:49:44 That changes, their.
11:49:46 He had.
11:49:47 It's not just that the conscious mind.
11:49:50 Needs to be.
11:49:52 Informed by the unconscious to use that metaphor.
11:49:56 If we consciously learn something that influences the unconscious mind.
11:50:02 Again.
11:50:03 You know Ericsson was.
11:50:05 Right on trusting your unconscious bond.
11:50:09 And he said.
11:50:10 When you're learning to ride.
11:50:12 You learn all of the shapes and the sizes, and so on.
11:50:15 Yeah.
11:50:17 And you form those in your conscious mind.
11:50:19 And they drop into your unconscious mind.
11:50:23 To become an unconscious learning that is there.
11:50:27 To to be available anytime in the future.
11:50:29 So he was introducing the idea.
11:50:33 That conscious learning.
11:50:35 Can inform.
11:50:36 The unconscious process.
11:50:37 You.
11:50:39 So.
11:50:42 When I, when I say sometimes the problem is the problem.
11:50:45 Sometimes the problem.
11:50:47 Is the solution.
11:50:49 Sometimes the problem isn't the problem.
11:50:51 I'm making noise here.
11:50:52 Yeah.
11:50:53 So, my! Just as I disagree with some of the things that Michael says.
11:50:59 Just like I disagree with some of the things that Bill says.
11:51:03 My invitation is for you. Please.
11:51:06 Disagree with anything that I say.
11:51:08 Alright!
11:51:09 But I'm not an expert at this.
11:51:13 What I can just talk about is my experience.
11:51:16 For you, to.
11:51:17 Say, Oh, yeah, that's useful. Oh, well, that's load of crap.
11:51:22 I'll try that. Oh, I'd never do that.
11:51:25 So we're just playing here.
11:51:27 Yeah.
11:51:28 So.
11:51:28 I remember when I 1st started with you and Rob, you and Tommy.
11:51:32 Continue what I'm doing.
11:51:34 Hit.
11:51:35 And I'll pick about that. And I think.
11:51:39 And I continued to do what I do, but I change.
11:51:42 Ish.
11:51:43 And I add to it, and yeah, um do it in any.
11:51:48 Exactly.
11:51:49 Yeah.
11:51:50 Beautiful. Thank you.
11:51:51 Yeah, thank, you.
11:51:52 Hmm.
11:51:54 Rob.
11:51:56 Yeah.
11:51:57 What do you think of this sign.
11:51:59 Every wiki.
11:52:01 Thank you.
11:52:03 French, live here.
11:52:04 Please keep both.
11:52:06 The rocks.
11:52:10 Few.
11:52:11 It took me a while, Rob.
11:52:13 Uh! I've I've made 4.
11:52:16 Um.
11:52:16 Um.
11:52:18 Flower bits.
11:52:19 Around 4 different Greece. One is huge, about 15 feet diameter, and the other ones are about.
11:52:25 Quite deep.
11:52:26 In diameter.
11:52:27 And we have a lot of docs here in but dogs and dog walkers, which is great. You know I love dogs. I.
11:52:34 Get down to their level, and I talk with.
11:52:38 When I, when I plant flowers inside.
11:52:42 The border were obsc. I found rocks over like the period of, I think, 4 years, and I you know I arranged them around in his, in a circle.
11:52:53 So.
11:52:54 I I noticed.
11:52:56 People walking their dogs, you know, because they're on their cell phone uh, probably listening to Michael's.
11:53:11 No.
11:53:03 How to get over my depression. Anxiety I don't know. Maybe it's my need to, you know, complain about, but it's like they're they're doing this, and their dog is doing that unleash. So.
11:53:16 And you know dog, p and pool can be, you know, disturbing to plans so.
11:53:21 I was like, what can I do? And.
11:53:23 I didn't like any of the signs that I saw, which is like, Keep off, or whatever.
11:53:29 So I was like, how can I make it.
11:53:32 Such that they know why.
11:53:33 I mean, I could have.
11:53:35 You know. Set.
11:53:36 Sometime, you know the the dog P is acidic, and it.
11:53:40 You know plants.
11:53:42 Get burned.
11:53:43 Especially.
11:53:44 Fragile, ones.
11:53:45 Mm.
11:53:45 I didn't want to put, so I I came.
11:53:48 I came up with this, and I'm gonna have it out there.
11:53:51 And see.
11:53:53 Sorry.
11:53:53 Yeah.
11:53:58 I I heard about a.
11:54:01 A research study. Years ago.
11:54:04 Where.
11:54:05 People were trying to grow tomato plants.
11:54:10 And I may have mentioned this before.
11:54:12 But um! The the question was, when you're growing tomato plants.
11:54:17 When there are weeds, is it better to pull up the weeds.
11:54:22 So that the tomato plans can grow.
11:54:25 That there's a.
11:54:27 Danger, of disrupting.
11:54:29 The roots of the tomato plants. When you pull up the weeds.
11:54:33 Or.
11:54:35 Is it better to spray.
11:54:38 The wage with weight. Killer.
11:54:40 Mm, Mhm.
11:54:42 Problem with that is that some of the weight killer will get to the.
11:54:45 Tomato Plants.
11:54:48 And.
11:54:49 Guess? What?
11:54:51 The best results came.
11:54:53 When the when the wage were just left.
11:54:56 To grow.
11:54:58 Mhm, Mhm.
11:54:59 Nope, don't pull them up, don't spray them, just leave them there.
11:55:04 You are not telling me to not put the sign there and have them have their way. Are you.
11:55:12 Mina, I would never say that.
11:55:16 Okay, I'm gonna give it a try if it doesn't work, you know.
11:55:21 Then um.
11:55:23 1 1 of my teachers from Chile.
11:55:27 Rafael, like Vera.
11:55:29 Mhm.
11:55:30 Write a paper.
11:55:33 About the evolution of.
11:55:35 Philosophy.
11:55:37 Could he propose?
11:55:40 That a philosopher said something.
11:55:43 And then someone read what the philosopher said.
11:55:47 And I said, Yes, I agree.
11:55:50 And there's something else.
11:55:53 So that next philosopher was able to develop.
11:55:56 Okay.
11:55:57 What happened to the his response to the first.st
11:56:01 In the next philosopher read the second one.
11:56:03 Initiate.
11:56:04 Oh, that's interesting!
11:56:06 And I agree.
11:56:07 And there's something else that I can do.
11:56:10 So Rafael.
11:56:11 Um proposed that that the.
11:56:14 History of philosopher.
11:56:15 Philosophy.
11:56:17 Is a history of.
11:56:19 Acceptance and extension.
11:56:23 And I really, really like that.
11:56:26 And I think that you know, Ericsson said, don't try and be like me. You couldn't anyhow be like you.
11:56:32 And so my invitation in that.
11:56:35 There's.
11:56:37 You can think. Oh.
11:56:39 Mcneely knows what he's talking about.
11:56:41 Is worth listening to.
11:56:42 But the sooner you stop listening to me.
11:56:45 And the sooner you start to do your own thing.
11:56:49 Like Doug was talking about.
11:56:51 I'm here.
11:56:52 So.
11:56:54 When are you going to stop?
11:56:58 Sessions like this.
11:56:59 That I'm running.
11:57:00 And when are you gonna start running your own sessions?
11:57:05 Oh, boy! Here we go again.
11:57:07 Here we go again. Blue Box is doing.
11:57:10 Blue bush is is doing, and what Lubash is doing is.
11:57:14 See if I can get this right.
11:57:17 It's ugly.
11:57:21 Is that the right word.
11:57:26 Oh!
11:57:23 I don't know which one you mean, because some sessions.
11:57:28 Oh, I put.
11:57:30 You got it mixed up with someone else. But I did some sessions.
11:57:34 With hairdressers.
11:57:35 Ah!
11:57:36 To um.
11:57:37 But it didn't take off.
11:57:40 Um. But there are programs that are doing now.
11:57:43 But I've I've been doing something very similar, but now they're doing it.
11:57:48 Um at the college where they teaches. I went there and.
11:57:52 I said, Well, you have to.
11:57:55 Um.
11:57:56 When you're teaching these people how to cut the hair and do all this.
11:58:00 Yes.
11:58:01 Maybe give them an idea. How can they talk to people.
11:58:03 Yeah, exactly.
11:58:04 Because it's important.
11:58:07 And you know it's kind of the Erisonian approach. Just listen to them and see what they say.
11:58:13 So. No, that was interesting, and I think a lot of that has called up with people. I'm just looking at.
11:58:21 I was going to mention this at the start. I'm just looking at some announcements someone's making.
11:58:28 Meeting at the Parliament. This is about Australia. So you know, we have this mental health strategies, and the Government's trying to do something. So they have a big meeting.
11:58:37 But it's mostly.
11:58:41 The existing associations. You know the Aps and and.
11:58:47 The established ones, and they complaining how there is a shortage of psychologists.
11:58:55 But is that really true?
11:58:57 Hmm.
11:58:57 Because their psychologies will tell you. Well, come and see me.
11:59:01 They want to have a full practice.
11:59:05 They don't say Oh, well, you know what could help.
11:59:09 If you go for a walk.
11:59:11 Yes.
11:59:11 Every day.
11:59:13 Like, you know the Eriksson story, how he had a patient that was depressed. So he told them, and they liked photography.
11:59:22 So take a photograph of a tree every day, and you have to get the top of the tree.
11:59:28 So that made them look up every day.
11:59:33 Their depression went away.
11:59:35 Very good.
11:59:36 But they did not have to go to a psychologist every 2 weeks and pay them $200, because.
11:59:45 Yeah.
11:59:47 Beautiful.
11:59:43 They like to do photography. So do what you like doing instead of.
11:59:49 What someone tells you to do.
11:59:51 So I think this is this is the the thing that we have to do. We have to listen to what people want.
11:59:59 And just let them do it.
12:00:01 Can I tell you another little story.
12:00:03 Before you do. I need to apologize.
12:00:06 I'm putting you in Denmark. You're from.
12:00:08 From the Czech Republic.
12:00:10 Yeah.
12:00:11 Stephanie.
12:00:11 My sister.
12:00:12 Did we.
12:00:14 Yeah, yeah.
12:00:16 I'm I'm saying saying.
12:00:20 Ah! Hoogie!
12:00:22 That's that's a Danish word meaning cozy.
12:00:25 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Hingley.
12:00:26 And then I got you got your my poor old Brian. See, it's it's time.
12:00:31 Moving to Chrome.
12:00:30 But I know a bit of Danish.
12:00:32 And my story is about Denmark.
12:00:35 It was.
12:00:36 Okay.
12:00:37 My sister came to visit me.
12:00:38 From Denmark.
12:00:40 Mm-hmm.
12:00:41 Last year.
12:00:43 And um, she's a psychologist.
12:00:46 Mm-hmm.
12:00:48 And I don't know if you know I have a method.
12:00:52 That I use.
12:00:53 To teach parents how to correct.
12:00:56 Children's Behavior.
12:00:59 So in early development from.
12:01:02 2 to 10 years. They often have tantrums. They don't want to go to school, they fight with their siblings.
12:01:10 There is a method that you can teach parents.
12:01:13 How to correct this.
12:01:16 And it's called the Golden Method.
12:01:18 Yeah, yeah, yeah, good.
12:01:19 You do it every day.
12:01:20 Yep.
12:01:20 Ah!
12:01:21 It's only few minutes every day, but.
12:01:24 For 12 weeks every day for a few minutes, that parents.
12:01:28 Statement. We call it a statement.
12:01:31 It's quite amazing. It's kind of like antibiotics. If you do it regularly and you do it for that period of time.
12:01:39 The bad behavior, stops.
12:01:41 Mm-hmm.
12:01:41 And people almost go like this is unbelievable.
12:01:44 Mm-hmm.
12:01:45 It. Actually, I've seen such difficult things that kids have been doing. And they stopped it.
12:01:52 As long as the parents do it in a proper way.
12:01:56 So I said to her, and she was curious about it, and she said, Oh, well, I don't do that. I'm just breaking with adults, but you know.
12:02:04 How does it work? So I told her.
12:02:07 I'll teach you the whole thing.
12:02:10 You have to buy the official book from the Institute, and that's.
12:02:16 You know cheap.
12:02:17 Anyway.
12:02:17 I gave her the whole training. She went back to Denmark and had a couple of clients with their kids.
12:02:24 So I said, How is it going.
12:02:27 Couple of miles later. After that.
12:02:29 So she said. About 3 months later.
12:02:33 She said. I'm not using that anymore.
12:02:34 I said, Why.
12:02:36 Is it not working.
12:02:37 She said, no, it's working too well.
12:02:42 I teach the parents.
12:02:44 They start doing it. I don't see them anymore.
12:02:46 I need to have them here every 2 weeks.
12:02:50 I'm I'm not making any money.
12:02:52 So I said, Well, that's great.
12:02:57 Ah, it's good for herself, but bad for a bank balance.
12:03:02 Better way.
12:03:03 So she refers to me some parents that want to learn it.
12:03:06 If they.
12:03:07 Don't want to come very often.
12:03:09 Hmm.
12:03:10 Customer is very expensive, so she said, No, I have some people that can't afford to pay. I'll send them to you because.
12:03:17 You know.
12:03:18 You don't care. I need to make more money.
12:03:22 Session, lighting.
12:03:24 Passing.
12:03:24 So.
12:03:25 Yeah, yeah.
12:03:27 Thank you.
12:03:26 I think that was interesting and funny as well.
12:03:28 Lovely.
12:03:29 That that absolutely lovely.
12:03:33 Lovely.
12:03:35 Okay. Well, it's getting to be time for us to stop today. I don't know how that time went, but anyhow.
12:03:41 Time. Does that kind of thing, doesn't it?
12:03:43 So thank you.
12:03:44 Raw.
12:03:45 Been willing to play, and being willing to explore.
12:03:49 And mainly you wanted to say something.
12:03:52 Yes, hook.
12:03:53 You know that bridge of voice the movie you told us a while back.
12:04:00 Would it help worry? Would it help.
12:04:04 Uh, that's 1 of the line. Okay? So there was a movie.
12:04:07 You recommend it.
12:04:08 Mhm.
12:04:08 It was called Bridge of Spice.
12:04:12 All bridges. Yes, yes, yes.
12:04:13 Bridge, of spice.
12:04:14 Measuring.
12:04:14 So Mark Rylance.
12:04:17 Who plays the role of one of the spies.
12:04:21 The main spy.
12:04:22 Key plays in another movie called The Island.
12:04:25 Island.
12:04:26 Wrong there.
12:04:27 I put it in the chat because Ricky and I watched it look about a week ago, and I.
12:04:33 It reminded me of you and the other movie. And this one is just as good, and you'll see.
12:04:40 Yeah.
12:04:41 The Island.
12:04:41 Yeah. So I just wanted to recommend it in case you haven't seen it.
12:04:46 I appreciate your recommendation. Thank you.
12:04:49 You're ah! You're rock!
12:04:50 Yeah, yeah.
12:04:50 Thank you. Yeah.
12:04:55 Okay, so.
12:04:57 Let's leave it at that today. Thank you for your presence and your willingness to.
12:05:03 Whatever your willingness.
12:05:06 And catch up with the next time.